be used when describing something on the internet. it just means something has gotten popular. >> you didn't say what it was. >> going viral? >> yeah. >> i lost interest. >> don't miss an episode of "the five." we'll see you back here tomorrow. "special report" is next. the new and improved obama care website. significant changes or cyberspace smoke and mirrors? this is "special report." good evening, i'm bret baier. while you were chowing down on turkey dinners and leftovers this weekend, the computer technicians behind the healthcare.gov website were frantically working to get their digital ducks in a row. today it was time to see if it all worked. we have fox team coverage tonight. bret is on how democrats may pay a heavy political price for obama care. jim angle with what may be

another broken promise from the president. peter doocy continues his attempts to sign up for insurance but we begin with ed henry on what, if anything, has changed. good evening, ed. >> reporter: good evening, bret. the administration took a bit of a victory lap over the weekend over healthcare.gov but tonight the question is whether online users are simply being pushed from one waiting line to another. president obama's aides struggled today to explain whether they really met the deadline to fix healthcare.gov after consumers reported getting a new page telling them there's so much traffic, they have been thrown into a queue to wait, which the white house insists is progress. >> i think you're confusing error messages with the queueing message, which is quite a different thing entirely. >> reporter: it was only yesterday the tech team led by jeffrey zients claimed victory in meeting the november 30th deadline, saying the site was doing so much better that the queueing system was not needed sunday. >> the site has been performing well in terms of response times

and error rates and, no, there has not been a need to deploy the queueing system at this point. >> reporter: with the surge of about 375,000 users logging on monday, errors and response times increased, so carney explained consumers were placed in the queue and told to come back at a better time. >> are there other lines? the goal is obviously to enroll more people, right? >> absolutely. >> so if they're still waiting -- >> ed, i would want you to the fact that more people are visiting the site and are able to effectively go from beginning to end when it comes to enrolling than was the case in october and in november. >> reporter: yet insurance companies put out a new warning that the back end systems of site meant to deliver consumer information to insurers are still not ready. >> what everybody wants to avoid is a situation where consumers think they're enrolled but their enrollments weren't able to be processed, they weren't able to

pay their first month's premium and their coverage isn't beginning on january 1st. >> reporter: kathleen sebelius issued a desperate plea, writing in "usa today," quote, to those americans who have experienced difficulties online, please do not give up. the new marketplace is an opportunity for individuals without employer insurance to obtain coverage, with choice and competition that was previously unavailable. though the administration's own progress report on healthcare.gov stated, quote, the team is operating with private sector velocity and effectiveness, raising questions about whether the administration can turn the corner. >> that is an acknowledgement that, you know what, if this was a government operation for a long time and it failed. now we're bringing in the private sector folks. i mean that is an indictment on the whole idea of government as a solution, frankly. >> reporter: now, david plouffe said yesterday on abc that when it comes to medicaid expansion, it may not really work very well until 2017, after the president

has left office. now, the white house stressed today he was only speaking about medicaid, not the broader law in terms of the success rate. but the bottom line is medicaid expansion is a key part of this law. this could be an attempt to start scaling back expectations when other democrats want to see progress by the end of 2014 in those midterm expectations. >> ed, thank you. back when the website went online for the first time, october 1st, we gave correspondent peter doocy the job of testing it out. and despite his best efforts, it has not gone well. tonight peter has an update. >> reporter: today is the biggest internet shopping day of the year. and websites for america's largest online retailers have been working just fine. but what about the new and improved healthcare.gov? so the white house says they have now doubled the capacity of healthcare.gov so 50,000 consumers can simultaneously shop. right now it's midday on cyber monday. i'd like to apply now to health coverage.

i'll select my state, which is virginia, down close to the bottom. apply online. and too many visitors. now, there is an option to leave your e-mail and ask for a one-time message when healthcare.gov is ready for my return so i will give them that e-mail and click to skip the wait. that e-mail queue is new, and so is this. a page of complete jibberish that popped up after simply clicking apply now for coverage. look at all those question marks. the white house says repairs to the site are being made and the administration says they have now isolated a problem that had been tripping up 834 forms which sent an applicant's information to insurance companies. >> more than 80% of the 834 production errors were actually due to one bug that prevented a social security number from being included in the application. >> reporter: officials claim a 90% success rate at healthcare.gov, but some experts are skeptical of that statistic.

>> what we're seeing are points that are clearly politically driven. clearly they are designed to soothe the nerves of people who have been asking questions. >> reporter: back in october, "consumer reports" told people to hold off on enrolling, but they are now satisfied with the fixes that have been made and are urging the uninsured to sign up quickly. >> when the troubles first started that people should stay away from the site, not forever, but to give them time to fix it, which they have now substantially done, at least for the part that consumers are using. >> reporter: the first time i asked healthcare.gov to e-mail me about a better time to return to the site was at 11:40 this morning. i finally got word that it was okay to go back more than five hours later, at 5:00 on the dot. bret. >> okay, we'll continue to follow your journey. peter, thank you. perhaps the biggest hit to the president's credibility in this whole mess has been self-inflicted. tonight chief national

correspondent jim angle with another presidential guarantee gone wrong. >> reporter: in an effort to deflect the criticism for having made the false promise that people could keep their plans and doctors no matter what, the president offered a new promise. >> most people will be able to buy better plans for the same price or even cheaper than what they have gotten before. >> that's not an accurate argument. so if your plan is now covering a bunch of things that you don't need, then how is it a better plan for you? >> you can do the math. most of the policies in his claim could spend more, cover more things, provide more visits, and charge less. so the arithmetic does not work. >> reporter: and it is sharply disputed by many, including a number of individuals experiencing sticker shock, even those with pre-existing conditions. >> i went from $891 a month to

$1437 a month. and also my deductibles all doubled. >> i would get the terrible, terrible plan with the $6,000 deductible. so i'll pay $1200 a year for that and be less insured than i am today. >> reporter: analysts argue those whose policies are cancelled will get coverage but not at lower prices. >> what we're seeing is that the new obama care plans typically have higher deductibles than the old plans did, a 98 rower choice of doctors and hospitals and yet higher premiums. >> it's very easy for a bronze plan to have deductible with total out of pocket costs that are $6,000. >> reporter: and one analyst points to a letter from one of the top officials implementing the law conceding subsidies won't help everyone. >> a letter from gary cohen to state health insurance commissioners saying while many people will have subsidies, there are still going to be some people paying more than they were paying. >> reporter: and a few days after his initial promises, the

president seemed to downgrade the pledge that most would get better coverage at lower prices. >> there's a good chance they'll be able to buy better insurance at lower cost. >> reporter: in fact one insurance plan that asked not to be identified analyzed its pool of 375,000 people and found even after subsidies, only 10% would actually see a decrease in costs, while one-third would face significant rate increases as a result of obama care. bret. >> jim, thank you. the president's par end up paying a stiff price for obama care. senior political analyst britt has some thoughts on that. >> the president's health reform plan is the stuff of jokes but the plts plit cal consequences will be felt. it's likely to prove the least of the problems. mr. obama's deceptive promise that no one would lose their doctors, hospitals or health insurance has done far greater

damage. people simply do not forget such conspicuous acts of bad faith. and many congressional democrats set to face the voters next year echoed mr. obama's false promise and are thus complicit in it. millions of americans have now lost coverage, millions more will. countless others are finding out their doctors or hospitals are not included in the obama care insurance offerings. now, in time obama care will undoubtedly produce some winners, especially those who were previously uninsured or who lost coverage but are able to find new policies at a subsidized price. the problem for democrats is that anger and disappointment are almost always more political moat varts than satisfaction and contentment. it is negative emotions that start political movements and drive people to the polls or sometimes the streets. remember, obama care was passed at a time when 80% of americans indicated in polls they were satisfied with their health care. disrupting that was the political equivalent of knocking over a hornet's nest, and there seems little doubt at this point

who is going to get stung. bret. >> you talk about winners. it appears you're talking about insurance coverage. we don't know about care at this point. >> exactly. for example, a lot of the uninsured and some who are losing their coverage are going to find themselves on medicaid. now, the reimbursement rates to doctors and other health care providers under medicaid are so low that a great many health care providers, doctors and the rest simply won't accept medicaid. so what you have for these people and perhaps many others as well, a growing doctor shortage, a growing shortage of hospitals that will take them. so what they ending up with is insurance, but not care. i think this is going to affect a lot of people and will add to the anger and resentment that we've talked about that others are already experiencing. >> all right, bret, thank you. up next, how the obama administration deals with a christian family fleeing what it calls religious persecution. but first here's what some of our fox affiliates across the country are covering tonight. khon in honolulu on hawaii's

first same-sex weddings. the state is hoping for a $217 million tourism boost over the next three years as a result of the new law. fox 31 in denver on their arrest of a woman for offering topless hair cuts to folks in longmont and johnstown. the charge, practicing cosmetology without a license is a federal offense, according to the district attorney's office there. and this is a live look at los angeles from fox 11. the big story there tonight, an investigation into the car crash that killed movie star paul walker and his friend saturday night. officials are focusing on the speed of the porsche right before the accident. that's tonight's live look outside the beltway from "special report." we'll be right back. hi honey, did you get e toaster cozy?

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the national transportation safety board says the train that derailed in new york city sunday morning was traveling 82 miles an hour as it approached a 30 miles per hour zone. four people were killed and dozens injured. the commuter train jumped the tracks while rounding a riverside curve. the ntsb says it is not aware of any problem with the train's brakes. as we noted earlier, today is cyber monday. the digital version of black friday. the national retail federation says there were a record number of shoppers in stores and on computers thursday through sunday, but that did not translate to record sales. stocks were down today. the dow lost 78. the s&p 500 was off 5, the nasdaq dropped 15. the u.s. supreme court has a message for the white house in the case of a family who came here from germany over the issue of home schooling. correspondent shannon breem has an update for us tonight.

get us up to date on this case involving this family and now the case is being considered by the supreme court. >> it is. they're devout christians that were very worried about what they were seeing their children were getting in germany. it was in direct conflict with their faith and decided to home school. they ended up fleeing to the u.s. because they thought this is the one country that will recognize their rights as parents. they were granted asylum here in 2010, but the obama administration decided to appeal that ruling and the family ultimately lost. their attorney told me today he's having a hard time understanding why this administration has con so much to stop arrests and deportations for illegal immigrants but is actively trying to deport this family. >> the fact that we have room for 12 million and not room for one family tells you there's something amiss about this administration. >> pie the way, bret, this family could lose custody of their children if forced to go

back to germany and they don't go to school there. >> all along they have argued this family doesn't qualify, they're not part of a recognized social group that should be given asylum and that's how we've ended up at the supreme court. and when their family attorney that we talked to there filed with the supreme court, the administration took the step of deciding not to file any type of response. so just days before the justices were scheduled to vote on whether or not to take up this case, the supreme court ordered this administration to file a response, explaining the government's position on why this family should be deported. that response is due december 19th. so if the schedule holds we could know in the next few weeks whether they get their day before the supreme court. it's their last resort. >> okay, shannon, thank you. we are going to talk about this case during the panel so you can ask some questions about it now. go to facebook.com/bretbayiersr or on twitter and use the #specialreport. still ahead, why the

pentagon may soon make it more expensive for military families to survive. first, your survival may be more at risk than ever. we'll explain new warnings about terrorism when we come back. ♪ [ alarm sound for malfunctioning printer ] [ male announcer ] you've reached the age where you've learned a thing or two. [ metal clanks ] ♪ this is the age of knowing what you're made of.

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the worst may be yet to come, from the former nsa contractor who is leaking national security secrets, and that fear comes at a time when we are being warned about our safety. here's chief intelligence correspondent katherine heritage. >> reporter: with the collapse of the arab spring and the rise of extremist groups, this recent attack in lebanon was blamed on an al qaeda franchise. the chair of the central intelligence committee spoke with candor on a sunday talk show. >> i think terror is up

worldwide. statistics indicate that. the fatalities are way up. >> reporter: the counterpart in the house, mike rogers, said we're fighting amongst ourselves about how the intelligence agency should operate, making it difficult to stop threats. against this backdrop, already leaked documents from edward snowden and threat of more were described as crippling. >> this is catastrophic for the safety and security of the american nation, what this very narcissistic young man has done. >> reporter: a review of the nsa leaks show the majority now deal with sources and methods and surveillance activities overseas rather than the privacy rights of american citizens. rogers says there's evidence suggesting edward snowden did not act alone when he downloaded some 200,000 documents. >> we know that he did some things capabilitywise that was beyond his capabilities. meaning he used someone else's help, we believe, to try to steal things from the people of the united states. >> reporter: and the congressman says there are questions about

snowden's stay in hong kong and his contact with a third party. >> there was some activity there in china about who he talked to and what was the purpose of his visit there, how was it arranged, how did he arrange a visa so quickly to russia. those kind of questions have not been answered in a satisfactory way. >> reporter: journalist glenn greenwald disputed the congressman's claims as baseless via 'em mail saying defenders of domestic surveillance can't keep their story straight. one minute they say snowden is a brilliant mastermind and the next minute they say he is a duns who must have had depp. he came back to fox saying he put the allegation to snowden, who remains in russia. greenwald said he insisted he acted alone and without any outside assistance. fox news has learned two more cia personnel are expected on capitol hill tomorrow before the house subcommittee on investigations into benghazi. that's according to a source familiar with the closed hearing.

tomorrow's witnesses are the last who are expected to testify about the response to the attack on the diplomatic facility. we've already established that in the health care rollout, honesty has not always been the best or official policy at the white house. tonight chief washington correspondent james rosen looks at how the u.s. dealings with iran have also been far from transparent. >> reporter: two years ago, we now know, then senator john kerry traveled to the middle east to help broker secret talks between u.s. and iranian officials. >> he went to amman in december of 2011. >> reporter: it was the associated press late last month that broke the secret talks with iran. this weekend politico followed up by reporting that then secretary of state clinton sent her top aide, jake sullivan, to owem oman shortly after kerry's visit. >> there have been reports that intermittently and outside of the formal p-5 plus one mechanisms, the obama

administration or members of it have conducted direct, secret, bilateral talks with iran. is that true or false? >> with regard to the kind of thing that you're talking about on a government-to-government level, no. >> reporter: many believe newland, now assistant secretary, was not among those who knew about the back channels, but secretary clinton did. >> we have from the very beginning made it clear to the iranians we are open to a bilateral discussion. so far there has not yet been any meeting of the minds on that. >> reporter: asked about what looks like a concerted effort to deceive the press and the public, the current spokesperson at state wouldn't confirm that jake sullivan met with them two years ago. >> is it the policy of the state department where the preservation of the secrecy of negotiations are concerned to lie in order to achieve that goal? >> james, i think there are times where diplomacy needs privacy in order to progress. this is a good example of that. >> reporter: marvin covered state for cbs news in the

nixon-kissinger era when he was wire tapped as part of a effort to conceal secret talks to end the vietnam war and open up china. >> and the president and the secretary of state believe that lying will enhance the security interests of the country, they will lie. i think the american people probably would want the president to do just that. >> reporter: state department officials said the secret talks with iran only became serious in march of this year and truly intensified only once iran had a new president in august, all after my exchange with victoria newland. bret. vice president biden has begun a week-long trip to asia aimed at showing the american commitment to the region. the vice president was greeted in tokyo by caroline the new ambassador to japan. he will travel to china and south korea later in the week. tensions are increasing over china's designation of an air defense identification zone, over disputed items claimed by

the japanese. there are people who want you to stop saying "he" and "she." we'll tell you why. and the simple code that could have started world war iii. "the grapevine" is next. arch sgh plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. with 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. if every u.s. home replaced one light bulb with a compact fluorescent bulb, the energy saved could light how many homes? 1 million? 2 million? 3 million? the answer is... 3 million homes. by 2030, investments in energefficiency

could help americans save $300 billion each year. take the energy quiz. energy lis here. more shopping. more dining out. and alo with it, more identity theft. by the time this holiday season is over, more than a million identities may be stolen. every time you pull out your wallet, shop online, or hit the road, you give thieves a chance to ruin your holiday. by the time you're done watching this, as many as 35 more identities may be stolen. you can't be on the lookout 24/7 but lifelock can. they're relentless about protecting your identity every mute of every day. when someone steals your identity and tries to take over your bank accounts, drain the equity in your home, or even tries to buy a car in your name, lifelock is on the job 24/7. when they detect a threat to your identity

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♪ because during the holidays, keeping your identity protected means keeping your family protected. now some fresh pickings from the political grapevine. the railroad industry has a big ad campaign going on called freight rail works. in which it brags that it spends billions of dollars improving infrastructure so taxpayers

don't have to. but mcclatchy reports that's not the whole story. so far the obama administration has doled out more than $600 million in federal investment to that industry. supporters say public investment mixed with private capital is an ideal mix. critics wonder why an industry that boasts about not needing taxpayers really needs their help. the associated press is the latest in a string of media and college organizations looking to do away with what they consider archaic notions of gender, as in "he" and "she." the a.p. writes the shes and hers that dominate the introductions are keeping third-person company with they, ze and other neutral alternatives meant to convey a more generous notion of gender. news busters notes there were no common sense critics in the story, just to mention that some

professors are confused or annoyed. and finally, you may not know, but only eight zeros acce separated the united states from nuclear armageddon. the daily mail and a number of other sites picked up a story from the day i learned which reports that from 1962 to 1977, the combination to fire americans' nuclear pay load was eight zeros. nuclear experts say the military was worried if communication lines were down it would be impossible to get security codes to those who needed them, so they bypassed the code, leaving it as eight zeros. in 1977, the codes were changed and "the daily mail" says what we are all thinking. hopefully to something more complicated. one of the perks of serving in the armed services may soon be eliminated. national security correspondent jennifer griffin is at the pentagon tonight with why the defense department may get rid of the way military families

save money on food. good evening, jennifer. >> reporter: good evening, bret. defense department budget cutters say everything is on the table in light of more sequester cuts, including a plan to close all u.s. base commissaries where military families shop for food at reduced rates, saving thousands of dollars a year on their grocery bills. the entire budget for commissaries is $1.4 billion a year. 178 commissaries would close in the u.s., including alaska and hawaii. 70 commissaries overseas would be exempt, but these figures don't tell the whole story. 30% of the employees at the commissaries are military spouses, so there will likely be unemployment attached to eliminating this perk. and the director of the defense commissary agency says that they have already cut their budget by $700 million since 1993. the proposal has received mixed reviews. >> i definitely think it's a bad

thing to take away the commissaries. that's a benefit that a lot of soldiers and family members utilize. >> i don't like it but i understand choices have to be made. so if it's this or cutting retirement paychecks, things like that, i think this is probably one of the least bad options. >> reporter: also on the chopping block, ending a $7.8 million subsidy for stars and stripes, the newspaper for the troops, first published during the american civil war and read by those in uniform ever since. the cuts would eliminate american forces radio and television service and its $51.6 million and the pentagon channel, which costs $6.1 million. a drop in the bucket, some argue, when you consider the $4 billion the pentagon has budgeted to assist the afghan military next year. congress would need to sign off on the cuts, but budget hawks say that in the era of costco and sam's club, military commissaries may be a subsidy for service members' families

that the pentagon can no longer afford. >> jennifer, thank you. it is monday. that means the sr pulse is back on the job. take a moment and watch the simple instructions there. it's your chance to sit on the panel. be a panelist and provide instant feedback. you can also access the pulse on your smartphone or tablet at bing.com/politics. is the obama care website fixed? what about the back end system? what is the real story? we'll ask the fox all stars all about it when we come back.

we have seen a steady improvement in the site, and that improvement continued over the weekend and today. >> people are going on. they're still getting the same error messages they got ten days

ago. >> i think you're confusing error messages with the queueing message, which is quite a different thing expire ntirely. the queue message is a specific tool that was upgraded and improved and made to be more sophisticated so that when there were surges in traffic on the website this day -- >> what's the goal then? the goal is obviously to enroll more people, right? >> absolutely. >> so if they're still waiting -- >> more people are visiting the site and are able to effectively go from beginning to end when it comes to enrolling than was the case in october and in november. significant improvements have been made. >> okay, the obama care website, this is the rollout over the weekend. 90%, they said it's active. there are still problems, however. and what about the back end of this system and the actual data that's going to the insurance companies? let's analyze it all. please join the panel on bing. let's bring in our panel, steve

hayes, senior writer for the "weekly standard." julie pace and charles krauthamm krauthammer. charles. >> i thought the government's own report when it said the website will operate at private sector velocity, which was unbelievable in its irony. here is an official government document, which is openly admitting that the private sector is infinitely superior to the public sector in doing stuff and it does this in a document which is trying to reassure us about an enterprise, obama care, which in fact is a deprivatization, a nationalization of the entire universe of american medicine, one-sixth of the economy. it makes you wonder if these guys even read their own stuff. the problem here is, number one,

the capacity is quite low. 50,000 is a very small number. amazon handles over a million an hour. here if you go to 50,000, you end up like peter doocy where you have to wait five hours until you get in a queue, a lovely british word, meaning in an endless wait until the website is ready for you. second is security. all the experts who were before congress a couple of weeks ago have said it is utterly insecure and they wouldn't use it in the absence of security. all kinds of information is now vulnerable. and the third is what you mentioned, the back ending. which means all these people are shoving information into a system which is either reaching the insurers incorrectly, in which case there are going to be huge complications. it could take eons to undo the bad information or is not reaching the insurers at all. in which case somebody will show up january 1st thinking he has insurance who doesn't and we'll

have all hell break loose. >> that is really the question and you heard a lot of those questions today at the white house briefing, especially what they call the 834s and that's the back-end forms. >> this is actually i think going to potentially be an even bigger problem than what we've seen so far with the website. because you have people, a small number but you have people that have actually managed to enroll. they're hoping that number goes up by december 23rd, the enrollment deadline for january 1st. the issue is that the information that these folks are putting into the system, when it shows up on the other end for insurers, it is either garbled, it is incomplete or not useable at all. and the worry is that someone thinks they have signed up for insurance and after january 1st, they go to the doctor and go to use these benefits and find out they may not be enrolled. so you've going to see a lot of focus trying to resolve that issue with the insurer and the data but also individual outreach to people who have enrolled making sure that the data is correct, making sure they have made their payments. because if the enrollment issue

becomes a big problem after january 1st, i think it will overshadow everything we've already seen. >> steve. >> this is always the problem. if you go back to the mid-october time frame, insurance companies were actually manually inputting the stuff that couldn't go through these 834 forms, so you had them actually putting additional people on to take the data, take it out and put it in their own formats, when all of this is supposed to happen electronically. so that's a huge problem. what the administration has basically done is repaint the front of a teardown. that's not going to do anything. the plumbing doesn't work. the back end is falling down. it might add to the curb appeal, but it's not going to ultimately sell the house and nobody is going to want to live there. that's the fundamental problem. in addition to the 834 problems, we are going to hear much, much more about other people that haven't yet been focused on losing their coverage or being asked to pay much higher premiums. and i'm talking about people who have supplemental medicare

plans, talking about people in the small employer market, as we've talked about before. this is going to go from bad to worse. and the administration -- this may last for a day or two. they can say, well, look, 90% is pretty good. it's still not the 99 plus percent that the private sector has, but 90% is still pretty good, but you're ultimately going to see additional problems and, finally, the major problems with the back end data are compounded if the front end actually does work well. that's the big difficulty. >> a lot of the trustworthy questions have come around, you can keep your health plan, you can keep your doctor and that's turning out to be for the most part when people dig into it not the case. jim angle has been doing some great reporting about this. he goes into the president's claim that most people will buy better plans for the same price or cheaper. take a look at this graphic. he talks to one insurance company in one state. can't release the name of the

company. 375,000 customers found that even after subsidies, only 10% would actually see a decrease in costs, while a third of them will face significant rate increases as a result of obama care. these are, you know, stats, one state obviously of 36 dealing with the federal exchanges. but when you go into the weeds of this, charles, it's quite something. >> well, that's why as you showed earlier in the show, the president has now dropped the word "most" because it's not going to be most. it will probably be a minority. could be a substantial minority, but it will be a minority. as britt indicated in his commentary, if you get lied to, if you're told you're going to have a decrease in the premium and then you learn, a, that the premium is increased, b, that your deductible is huge, and c, that you can't see your own doctor or use your own hospital, the anger and resentment at the 80% of americans who in a poll

at the time obama care was passed indicated they liked the insurance they already had, the anger and resentment about this, first about the actual loss of what they had and the increase in costs and second about the deception is going to be overwhelming and that's why democrats are scared to death, especially the ones who are open for re-election next year. how do you escape that? there is no escape. >> and quickly, julie, when you hear david plouffe this weekend saying it may take until 2017 until things get cooking, what is that white house thinking? >> that is not what they are hoping for. they would like to see this working effectively in the next couple of months. i think david plouffe said something that is probably more realistic, that this is something that is incredibly complex and if it works it will take a long time, 2017.

the president will be out of the white house at that point. >> i think the white house will launch a major attack on republicans accusing them of sabotaging the plan. i think that's coming in the next several days, next couple weeks. next up, a german family seeking asylum in the u.s. over home schooling their kids. ♪ you know, ronny... folks who save hundreds of dollars by switching to geico sure are happy. and how happy are they jimmy? i'd say happier than a bodybuilder directing traffic. he does look happy. get happy. get geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance.

there they are, the german family, devout christians. they say they're alarmed about what their children were learning in german schools. they came to the u.s. to home school them. it's illegal in germany, but they were granted asylum here in 2010 but the obama administration decided to appeal that ruling and the family lost. they could lose custody of the

kids if they go back to germany. now it appears the u.s. supreme court is going to take up this case, and the obama administration is saying they're not eligible for protection because home schoolers are not recognized as a social group, eligible for protection. we're back with the panel. steve. >> well, it's a fascinating case. i think it's a testament to the power of home schoolers here in the united states, that they were able to raise this. and you saw the comments from michael ferris earlier to the point where we're now having a national discussion about this and the supreme court is taking an interest in it. what's interesting to me is that the supreme court by asking the interest in it. what's interesting to me, the supreme court by asking the administration for a response to make some kind of a judgment as shannon bream explained is signaling they're interested in the issue. it doesn't mean they're going to take it up. they're signaling they're interested in the issue and they want to potentially weigh in on it in one way or another.

it's entirely possible we'll see some sort of resolution over this in the coming weeks. it'll be interesting to see how the obama administration would handle it diplomatically if the united states serves as, in a sense, a refuge for religious persecution in italy. >> is this the perfect example of religious persecution? why must one belong to a group to be in consideration? >> it's an interesting question. i think that that's what this case explores. whether you do need to be part of a group or whether you can make this claim of religious persecution as an individual. you know, yet to steven's point about the supreme court, it is not unusual for the supreme court to ask the administration to weigh in on a case that the administration has not already weighed in on. >> and they might not take the case. >> they may not take the case. it is certainly an indication when they do ask the administration to weigh in on something, it is often an indication it is something they do want to take up and they want to know the administration's position before doing so.

>> tony buckley writes in regarding the family. is there a winning argument, charles, against the administration's position they're taking? if so, what is it? >> i think the argument is a rather complicated one. an interesting one. i think ultimately it's a question of whether a personal interpretation of your religion would be the grounds for giving you asylum on the grounds of persecution. or whether it has to be a widespread one. for example, if germany had denied the family the ability to declare the godhood of christ, it would be no question that would be persecution of a christian on the grounds of his religion. the question of whether or not the belief that the family has, that to allow a child to go to public school is against the religion, because of the corrupt way or any religious way that that children are taught, is clearly a minority view, a personal view. and i'm extremely sympathetic with that family.

and i wish it weren't being, you know, persecuted, having the threat of their children removed. but as a question of our principle of granting asylum, if the court takes it up, it's going to have to decide how widespread a belief has to be to actually be one that the united states would recognize persecution. otherwise there is a danger of a lot of personal interpretations, which it would have to defend and become a huge magnet for asylum requests. >> i mean, the lawyer is saying the administration has done a lot to stop arrests and deportations of illegal immigrants. but yet is actively trying to deport the family. >> right. charles is exactly right. the context question works in two different ways. you could say on the scale of religious persecution this is not as bad as beheading. at the same time, 12 million illegals coming in. there's a double standard. >> those, i think, are different issues. >> let's stay tuned for a world competition ahead of the winter

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here are tonight's bing highlights. there was high agreement for men and women when charles quoted the government's own report, saying the private sector operates better than the public sector. and democrats disagreed with steve when he said the data management problems for insurers are going to hurt imp lemation. the highest intensity of the night, the political argument about health care. total votes tonight, 253,000. finally tonight, ahead of the winter olympics, another world competition. >> three, two. >> woo hoo! >> i changed my mind! i changed my mind! >> hurry up and get it over with. >> three, two --

[ screaming ] >> germany, the big winner in screaming -- i don't know. i guess i don't know. we're not sure about that one. thanks, everybody. that's it for this "special report." fair, balanced and unafraid. greta goes on the record right now. think about this. do you care what the obama administration believes about its own website? or do you want the facts? >> the president believes that the site has been significantly improved. >> unfortunately, as people enroll, i think there's going to be a lot of negative surprises. >> the administration has hit the big benchmarks they set out. 50,000 people at one time. 800,000 people a day. >> the system that transfer data to the insurance companies and takes care of the payments is not working yet. >> it is certainly working reasonably well. >> from what we know from the anecdotal evidence so far, a lot of people are going to be extremely disappo